Dr. Sarno versus science

Discussion in 'The Howard Stern Show' started by Gretsch Man, Mar 6, 2012.

  1. Gretsch Man

    Gretsch Man Well-Known Member

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    http://www.bettermovement.org/2011/a-skeptical-look-at-the-theories-of-dr-john-sarno/

    I'd post the entire article here, but it's kind of a long read. It's worth it if you're interested though.

    "Tension myositis syndrome" is what Sarno proposes as being the actual cause of back pain. By "proposes," I mean he pulled it out of his ass.
     
  2. Big Bird

    Big Bird New Member

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    Sarno is a loon, Howard is a sucker for believing that clown:facepalm:
     
  3. telecaster

    telecaster Get Yer Ya Ya's Out

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    It's simple. Dr. Sarno is God.
     
  4. SouthernListen

    SouthernListen I don't follow the crowd. Sorry about that. VIP

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    Easy way to test this theory. Take a narcotic pain reliever. If the pain goes away, it's not in your head.
     
  5. Gretsch Man

    Gretsch Man Well-Known Member

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    You might be on to something there. ;)
     
  6. Shvoogie Button

    Shvoogie Button Member

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    I read Dr. Sarno's book (because of Howard) and it fixed my neck pain.

    Here me out before you call me a loser....


    Here's my synopsis:

    1) Have you ever blushed? Yes, so you agree that the body can send blood (or take it away) from certain areas based upon your psychological state.

    2) Ever notice how ailments go in trends... lower back pain, carpel tunnel syndrome, acid reflux, etc....

    2b) Behavior hasn't really changed from year to year so therefore many people are experiencing the symptoms of ailments just because it's popular ie trendy.


    Do you accept that?????

    If yes, then you have to ask yourself... Since I have a trendy ailment am I just a loser or is something actually wrong with me?

    Remember that with 99% of people with your ailment it's all in their head. So are you one of those 99% or do you really have something wrong with you?

    blah blah blah... you have other issues your mind is trying to distract you from blah blah blah...

    Go to bed saying, "Is it possible that I'm just a loser....." a few days later the neck pain is gone and you're like, wow, I'm a fucking loser!


    bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
     
  7. EmperorsNewCaps

    EmperorsNewCaps Member

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    Yeah, I'm sure it's effective as any other garden variety self-help mind over matter bullshit my mom reads, Shvoogie, that's not the point. The point is it isn't pure fact and hard science like Howard acts like it is, it doesn't prove back pain or other ailments are non-existent like he believes it does, it proves man's mind is narcissistic, neurotic and his own worst enemy.... like he and a lot of other human beings are, not people with real back injuries or genuine physical issues.
     
  8. illini fan

    illini fan New Member VIP

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    Come on guys ever heard of the placebo effect? same thing....

    ...by the way where can you buy these on the net?
     
  9. ConFuzioN

    ConFuzioN Member

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    Sarno Is A Greedy Crazy Man
     
  10. Peau de Soie

    Peau de Soie Edit Button? Thanks LaserTilt!

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    Hucksters of all stripes have made money off the placebo effect for thousands and thousands of years. I see no reason why Doc Sarno or chiropractors or "homeopathy" pushers or religious faith healers should be any different. People are stupid. And they seem to like it that way.
     
  11. Woof

    Woof Liver Shots? VIP

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    Strength and Stretching exercises would be the Best prevention for Back pain.....What do you expect,we evolved from four to two legs,it's a 'compromised' adaption,NOT an original full developed/tested design.
     
  12. SmellyHorseBeth

    SmellyHorseBeth New Member

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    I found Dr John Sarno through Howard Stern and his books have had a life changing impact on me. He is a knowledgeable and educated medical doctor. If you are a chronic back sufferer, don't discount what he has to say outright.

    Possibly the one true positive bit of wisdom I have gleamed from that show - even if by referral.

    Suffered from severe back pain beginning in my early teens and it persisted into my 20s. Real and consistent crippling pain that was aggravated by several sports accidents. Couple of times a year I would be locked up on the floor for the entire day with spasms. The residual effects would last for days or often weeks.

    Read one book and I haven't ever had those symptoms again.


    It is my opinion that the medical establishment, in America especially - is one of the most corrupt organizations known to man.
    Their research is funded by big pharma and that's where it is focused. Treatments have to be profitable. They aren't in the business curing disease and empowering people. Follow the money. That is all besides the point.

    Clearly Stern is not an intellectual and no one should look to him for technical explanations behind Sarno's theories - He's an obnoxious radio personality with ADD and in no way qualified to provide them.

    I don't have all of the answers either, but I have a healthy respect for alternative thinking individuals willing to challenge the industry's status quo. Risking their reputations and careers to analyze their research from a fresh perspective.

    Dr John Sarno is legitimate researcher, an open minded, independent thinker who does not adhere to strict establishment guidelines.
    Don't confuse that with hucksterism, they are polar opposites.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2012
  13. Peau de Soie

    Peau de Soie Edit Button? Thanks LaserTilt!

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    So reading the book got you to stop pretending you had back pain? Is that basically it?
     
  14. SmellyHorseBeth

    SmellyHorseBeth New Member

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    No, I don't think it is that simple. It's not easy to explain. The pain was real, just muscular in nature and not structural as it seemed. I believe my acceptance of this somehow altered my blood flow to physically affected areas. I also become conscious of certain repetitive motions that I previously ignored that exacerbated the situation.
     
  15. Peau de Soie

    Peau de Soie Edit Button? Thanks LaserTilt!

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    Great, that theory is completely testable. If ole Doc Sarno wanted to save the world all he'd have to do is get some studies done to show that this "altered blood flow to physically affected areas" phenomenon is real and not just all in your head.

    Not saying you weren't cured -- it's great that you were. The question is about the mechanism, and whether it is in any way distinguishable from the regular placebo effect. (That is, if you were convinced that a sugar pill would have the same effect, would it have worked as well as the book did.)
     
  16. gilaet

    gilaet Zen As Fuck Gold

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    Oh-wah-tah-goo-siam!
     
  17. Peau de Soie

    Peau de Soie Edit Button? Thanks LaserTilt!

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    Oscar?
     
  18. SmellyHorseBeth

    SmellyHorseBeth New Member

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    Clearly this is just my limited understanding of the phenomenon. The argument is that the psychosomatic component of the theory makes performing clinical trials inherently difficult.

    My point isn't that Dr John Sarno represents hard science. I come from a R&D background myself and I am aware of the difference. It is just that I find value in alternative thinking and specifically in Sarno's conclusions.

    The fact that everyone knows the 'sugar pill, placebo effect' analogy speaks to me of the clear relationship of the mind over the body. Sarno’s theories, while related to that phenomenon go beyond a simple a miracle cure in a pill. His method is to provide information in the form of an accessible and plausible theory to the underlying cause of the pain.

    I put my self out there for one reason and it is that this one little book made a big difference for me and it might for someone else too.
     
  19. Peau de Soie

    Peau de Soie Edit Button? Thanks LaserTilt!

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    But, but that's bullshit. That's what every quack says. Believing in what the book tells you and benefiting from it should be in no way adversely affected by sensors that measure blood flow to your affected areas. If anything, the extra attention and fuss should speed the effects. If it's real, it has to be testable, either now or in the future. Psychosomatic is one thing, "spiritual" is another. Unless he's claiming spiritual effects (in which case all rational bets are off) the effects of his book HAVE to be testable.
     
  20. SmellyHorseBeth

    SmellyHorseBeth New Member

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    I know that his theories are not without controversy - funding for clinical trials even without that stigma does not come easy. I’ve never read of him theorizing a spiritual component to any of this.


    He has consistently updated his theories as his understanding has increased.

    I don't necessarily disagree with your skepticism.

    Tho you said yourself that you don’t know if the appropriate blood flow measuring “sensors” are even available. And really, there is no way to assume “attention and fuss” would affect the results one way or another. As a proponent for the scientific method, why would you make that assumption?